Lauren: I do see what you are saying, and it performs into this quite trippy concept, which is this concept of like, it seems we personal nothing.

Gideon: Mmm.

Lauren: And we do not, we do not actually personal something. Right? I imply, I feel that for the reason that existence of bodily items, there have been completely different possession fashions or constructions, completely different types of bartering, of loans, of lease to personal. I feel within the post-industrial period, that most likely solely elevated. We’ve all the time had some type of subscriptions. You know, even when they weren’t digital subscriptions. So I feel what you are, what you are choosing at, is that existential query. Like, what does it actually imply to personal one thing?

Gideon: I, no, that I feel I’m not, really. I feel I’m simply saying that possession is all the time a assemble, and, you already know, proudly owning a home, proudly owning the land that it is on, proudly owning any object is a assemble. Like cash as a assemble or companies as a assemble. All of these items are constructs that we have constructed, we have created, to make society work, and we will select to alter them. And perhaps what I’m saying is it is not apparent to me that it is unsuitable to alter the assemble of possession. I feel the place I come down on the identical facet as you is that the widespread thread in all of that is that companies are getting extra energy over people, and so they’re getting to decide on for us what can we have now, what can we see, what can we alter, how our expertise is formed. And that feels uncomfortable. It’s, it is the ability and management half. It’s much less even concerning the idea of possession itself.

Lauren: Right. It’s that the connection has modified between “I give you this money for this good, and this is the exchange that’s supposed to happen, and this is the result that is supposed to come from that.” And impulsively it is like, the service provider that you’ve got paid is saying, “Actually, the terms have changed.” Yeah. And so inside that assemble, an imbalance has been launched.

Gideon: Right.

Lauren: So the web has created, you already know, this unbelievable period of manufacturing and distribution and dissemination of products and digital items. But now the buyer is on the receiving finish of it, saying, “Well, hey, like, what just happened to that thing I paid for?”

Gideon: Right. It’s such an fascinating instance of the flip sides of know-how, proper? The web has this so-called democratizing impact in some ways and offers individuals entry to issues they did not have earlier than, and instruments they did not have earlier than. And on the similar time, it is also a method of taking away possession, and possession as a type of independence. I feel perhaps for me, that is the, the essential factor right here is that it is about autonomy and the best to make decisions for your self.

Lauren: Hmm.

Gideon: One of the issues that is fascinating about this subject is, what are the politics of proper to restore and of digital possession? Because I consider them as basically progressive points on this nation, however there is no purpose why they need to be. Right? Ownership—